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October 07, 2009


Nell is keeping track of the best information about the fight to reverse the Honduran coup at A Lovely Promise.

What happens there is extremely important. If Honduras's vicious right-wing oligarchy succeeds, the vicious right-wing oligarchies in the rest of Latin America will almost certainly be inspired to similar actions in their countries.

And here's an interesting fact: bubbling beneath the surface of the tea party demonstrations in the U.S. was the hope that what happened in Honduras would happen here.

P.S. I haven't had time to check, but I'm 100% sure all the liberal U.S. blogs that were posting non-stop about Iran are doing the same about Honduras. That's because their Iran posts had nothing to do with Iran being an Official Enemy, and everything to do with concern for electoral integrity everywhere.

Posted at October 7, 2009 10:50 PM

The libluggers must be busy since they also have to demand justice in the Afghan vote heist too.

The Obomb isn't getting overthrown by warmongering oligarchs, as he's doing everything they hired him to do.

Posted by: Marcus at October 7, 2009 11:40 PM

We've got ravening hordes of Serious People toying with the idea of imposing harsh sanctions on Iran and then bombing them if the perfidious Persians manage to sneak enough goods in via the black market to neutralize the sanctions, so at least some of the emphasis on Iran rather than Honduras is justified on the grounds that it reminds us that those brave demonstrators are the people we'd be hurting with sanctions or blowing up with bombs.

You'd have to judge motives on a blog-by-blog basis.

OTOH, as far as the MSM or the politicians are concerned, bad motives and hypocrisy can be taken for granted.

Posted by: Donald Johnson at October 7, 2009 11:43 PM

But the attention on Iran's election isn't meant to remind us that we may soon be bombing those protester's, it's meant to remind us that in Gulf War III: Operation Doomsday the bombs falling will be Freedom-loving O-bombs, meant to Protect and Serve, not clutch at the last strands of global hegemony and raise oil prices. And the spin put on these Iran "rigged" election reports are going to do what they are supposed to, reaffirm the fear of implacable Islamic tyranny, except amongst the very few who already think of Iranians as fellow humans going about their lives with no intention or ability to harm Americans.

Posted by: Marcus at October 7, 2009 11:54 PM

Again, Marcus, it depends on the blogger. I read a few bloggers who focus on the Mideast and on Iran and haven't said much if anything about Honduras and they oppose any attack on Iran, while also condemning the brutality of the Iranian government towards the demonstrators.

You also seem to know that the elections weren't rigged. I'm not going to argue about that.

Posted by: Donald Johnson at October 8, 2009 12:17 AM

"You also seem to know that the elections weren't rigged. I'm not going to argue about that."

Bad writing on my part. That was meant to be mildly sarcastic but maybe it came across as me agreeing that they weren't rigged. . I read a fair number of people who were sure the elections were fair and that this was all a US/MSM made-up story about stolen elections and also people who said the elections were rigged. If I have to guess, I vote "rigged", but am about as far from being an Iranian expert as they come.

Posted by: Donald Johnson at October 8, 2009 12:23 AM

The Domino Theory in reverse: one successful coup might provide an example of successful defiance that would result in the rotten apple spoiling the barrel. If Honduras falls, what are we going to do about all those other little countries?

Posted by: Sam at October 8, 2009 02:53 AM

That's a lovely photo at the link. Even before seeing it I was going to say that the envy of Honduran generals doesn't seem too far beneath the surface to me. One of those charmers over at WorldNetDaily actually wrote a column a few weeks ago saying our military would be justified in having a coup (though of course he was sure to say there is absolutely no precedent for that in the United States).

Nell certainly covers a lot of valuable ground on Honduras. But you guys aren't reading it--shame on you--because I can go over there and post overly long paragraphs with themes like "ONE MOMENT PLEASE, OBAMA IS NOT THE PROBLEM!" and none of you show up having a stroke or come to Nell's aid with any ranting or raving at how ridiculous that is to any thinking person like you.

One of my own few areas of knowledge that is personal rather than from books is of the elite in Latin America and how they view politicians with populist leanings. That I've seen live and in person, and even actually a little close for comfort. You used to be able to sum it all up with one word: CASTRO! But nowadays you need two: CASTRO and CHAVEZ! (The 'all caps' is actually how I think most of the wealthy hear those two words even when they are just thinking.) Our own elite and the military have the same Pavlovian reaction. When they hear CASTRO! or CHAVEZ!, they start thinking and acting like those yahoos and their sign at the link our host provided. For the Hondurans, it makes it pretty easy to rationalize clampdowns on any form of progressive political change. You just chant "CHAVEZ!" any time Zelala's name is mentioned and do then whatever you want on the ground that it will save the republic and democracy. And so, in Honduras, curtailing all civil rights and canelling elections saves democracy, and putting pictures of young women killed by the army in the papers would be tasteless.

Mr. Schwartz's bullshit meter is working about the difference between Iran and Honduras. But there are reasons for concern about that region that go beyond the dislike of our perpetual hypocrisy. Does anyone even know that the U.S. just struck a deal with Colombia for seven military bases? That kind of thing should be a big deal, because it's how our prewar "involvements" usually begin. Chavez apparently has called the agreement between the US and Colombia an act of war, and I don't think he's being hyperbolic. It is definitely war planning, and when the Pentagon plans for war, war usually follows sooner or later.

Posted by: N E at October 8, 2009 07:48 AM

Does anyone even know that the U.S. just struck a deal with Colombia for seven military bases?

Actually, yes. But Obama won, so it's all good now.

Posted by: NomadUK at October 8, 2009 08:46 AM

N E: "because I can go over there and post overly long paragraphs with themes like 'ONE MOMENT PLEASE, OBAMA IS NOT THE PROBLEM!'"

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. Despite all your protestations, N E, you have never shown that Obama really wants to be doing anything he isn't doing. I know it's a central doctrine of the Obamabot faith that one day he'll rip off the mask and show himself to be a True Progressive or something, but as Noam Chomsky always says, look at the actions not the words. Even in his words he's not at all inspiring.

Posted by: Duncan at October 8, 2009 09:53 AM

She said the [police] kicked out most of her top teeth, broke her ribs and split open her head. “A policeman spit in my face and said, ‘You will die,’ ” she said, adding that the attack stopped when a police officer shouted at the men that they would kill her.

I wonder what's going on in the heads of those Honduran cops. Something more than "I have to do this to keep my job," I'd say.

Posted by: SteveB at October 8, 2009 09:58 AM

I read Nell, NE/Ovid. And I argued with you once over there and a few times here, but it doesn't have to be repeated every few months.

Posted by: Donald Johnson at October 8, 2009 10:02 AM

Jon Schwarz: OT, article in Popular Mechanics is close enough. I seem to remember the words "Industrial Activity" in what I read, but that's close enough to prove SOMEONE KNEW back then what was happening with global warming and they knew the EXACT causes. 55 years of procrastination and THEN WE wake up and wonder WTF???

Posted by: Mike Meyer at October 8, 2009 11:23 AM

Iran=bombs, Honduras=Cocaine. SOMEWHERE in downtown Washington D.C. these 2 equations cross each other.

Posted by: Mike Meyer at October 8, 2009 11:32 AM

Duncan: I hope you appreciate me giving you the chance to use the words "Obamabot" and "Chomsky," because that was my gift to you for the day!

Donald Johnson: I commend your discipline.

Posted by: N E at October 8, 2009 12:32 PM