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January 13, 2007

I Guess We Should Be Grateful For The Baby Steps

Glenn Greenwald has the text of an NPR commentary by National Review writer Rod Dreher, who's having a crisis of conscience over Iraq:

I had a heretical thought for a conservative - that I have got to teach my kids that they must never, ever take Presidents and Generals at their word - that their government will send them to kill and die for noble-sounding rot - that they have to question authority.

On the walk to the parking garage, it hit me. Hadn't the hippies tried to tell my generation that? Why had we scorned them so blithely?

Uh, no. It wasn't "the hippies" who tried to tell Rod Dreher that. It was EVERYTHING THAT'S EVER HAPPENED IN ALL RECORDED HUMAN HISTORY. But I can see how it's easy to mix that up with "the hippies."

Posted at January 13, 2007 02:00 PM | TrackBack

So now I want to know: Is Rod Dreher going to take the President's challenge and come up with an alternative solution to Iraq or is he just gonna whine about how his expectations have been dashed by the president?

Posted by: Aunt Deb at January 13, 2007 02:19 PM

Why do war supporters like Aunt Deb always expect people who criticise the war to come up with a plan to fix it? I always thought invading Iraq was a bad idea - Bush and Co. supported by people like Aunt Deb stuffed it up - therefore they should fix it. It is no-one else's responsibility to come up with a solution for their mistakes. The Republicans and people like Aunt Deb should act like adults and take responsibility for their own actions in starting and supporting a stupid war for once, instead of expecting someone else to bail them out.

Posted by: Twiggy at January 13, 2007 04:22 PM

Twiggy, your irritation is understandable, but I believe that was a joke.

Posted by: Jonathan Schwarz at January 13, 2007 04:50 PM

I'm reminded of the Vanity Fair article which quotes Perle's, Adelman's and Frum's dismay over how things have turned out. Dreher seems to have had a greater epiphany than have those shitbirds, but the question I have is the same: Is he for real, or is this an attempt at repackaging? Dreher is the genius behind the 'crunchy con' nonsense, don't forget.

Posted by: Lloyd at January 13, 2007 05:47 PM

Thank you, Jonathan.

Posted by: Aunt Deb at January 13, 2007 06:26 PM

Sorry guys - it was my first visit to the site - and I've seen so many other comments like this at other sites that were meant seriously that I just couldn't help myself.

Posted by: Twiggy at January 13, 2007 07:27 PM

Yeah. And anyway hippies got nuthin' on the crazy conspiracy theorists who argue that "question authority" is also a secret message concealed within the US constitution and its explanatory ephemera.


(or maybe not)

Posted by: radish at January 13, 2007 09:33 PM

I'm 6 years older than Dreher and I've never met a "hippy". Or at least a self-described one.

The only time I recall an adult using the term "hippy" was when "2001: A Space Odyssey" came out and my grandfather took us 3 kids to a puppet show in downtown Los Angeles (this was 1968, according to the IMDB). I remember showing up for the show and there were a bunch of questionable characters hanging around the theater and my Grandfather huffed "I'm not seeing some show done by a bunch of goddamn hippies!" and he (we) stormed out. In lieu of this adventure we went to the Egyptian Theater in Hollywood to see "2001". Gramps worked on the Apollo program at Rockwell (as a machinist) and was really into space stuff.

We sat through the entire thing but I remember Grandpa huffing all way home, saying "what the HELL was that about? What the HELL what that?"

Good times.

Posted by: none at January 13, 2007 10:26 PM

I regularly stand on a street corner holding an anti-war sign. Not a week goes by that someone does not call me a god-damn hippy. As I am middle-aged, quite tailored and conservative looking, all I can figure is: not wanting to see people blown up=hippy. It doesn't bother me a whit; but I do often think how topsy-turvy is a world where peace-loving is considered an epithet.

Not to worry, Twiggy. It's not easy these days. Wir sind alles satirists jetzt.

Posted by: New Day at January 13, 2007 11:44 PM

Speaking of satire, Jon Swift is on his game tonight:

Not only did I laugh until my teeth rattled; I also learned why peace is unAmerican.

Posted by: New Day at January 14, 2007 12:27 AM

it actually is not the responsibility of Bush and the Republicans to stop the war in Iraq. THEY DON'T WANT TO. They want that "sweet, sweet crude" and in addition they want the utter TERROR that their seeming "omnipotence" creates in people in THE UNITED STATES that might oppose them. Eh? How's that? Why should it be BUSH'S responsibility to end a war that makes him money?

HE doesn't have to do any fighting. he's a "pencil dick" -- a guy who remains far away from the violence and sits on his ass sending OTHERS off to fight for him. It is a means of rule and it's actually becoming obviously pretentious to call it anything other than a Constitutional Monarchy.

It is the responsibility of those who don't want war to create a divergent possibility. Bush won't do it -- he's building an EMPIRE to rule the future based on the agenda he has set up. It IS and will remain the ACTUAL RESPONSIBILITY of those who desire a divergent possibility to create that.

and objectively it's about Democracy. the first constitutional congress almost tore itself apart in 1789 BECAUSE people wanted Actual Democracy -- and the existance of Slavery made that an absurd lie. But Republic won out, and as such, we can see by following the "trails of blood" by which i mean both genetic pathways...and, well...

what will actually happen is that those who have better ideas will be laughed at, fakely, and slandered, actually, until the ancient tool of Xeno the Elean, reductio ad absurdem, is once again used by The People to deal with the Monster created by Plato so many centuries ago that still rules us today. And of course, most people are hypnotized, deceived to accept their brutal and deceitful masters. when people really get tired of the lies it will be the beginning of the end.

but not of The World. They use that threat to keep people in line.

Posted by: Mikal Haley at January 14, 2007 01:14 AM

Dirty f*cking hippy here. Yep, I'm a real one, came of age in 1967 and had a great time. Got drafted into the Marine Corps in 1969 and served two years, doing my best to question authority in any way I could without getting into major trouble. Happily, I made a perfect score on the AFQT and got into a good schooling program in electronics which kept me out of Nam.

Anyway, I thought the quote below might be germaine to the discussion here. We've been warned by lots of people, but here is a true expert:

"Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger."

-- Herman Goering at the Nuremberg trials

Peace, love, drugs.

Dirty f*cking hippy, out.

Posted by: Jonathan at January 14, 2007 09:20 AM

I've been taking part in anti-war vigils since Dec. 2003. For a while, "hippy" was the slur of choice and then there was a spate of "Commie". That was really odd, I thought.

Posted by: Aunt Deb at January 14, 2007 02:29 PM

The most immediate return of a nation state's investment of rearing a child comes during wartime.

Posted by: Toadvine at January 16, 2007 01:55 PM

If only we had all listened to Jerry Garcia back in the day. Great find on that quote!

Posted by: Comandante Agi at January 16, 2007 05:07 PM

Please. it is hippIE, not hippY. Not ever. And for those of us that grew up in S.F. in the 60's, NO ONE was a "hippie" after 1968, when we had the "death of the hippie" march through Haight-Ashbury. Casket and all.

You might have had long hair, got smokey sleepy on pot, tripped on LSD, listened to free concerts by The Airplane at G.G. park, burned your bra or draft card in protest against the asinine fiasco in Indochina, but then you were just an average 60's American.

Please. It is hippie, not someone with a wide waist.

Posted by: farang at January 17, 2007 09:20 AM