Comments: Friends

If the words "right now" are supposed to be a link, it's not working.

Posted by Donald Johnson at January 28, 2011 01:24 PM

What kind of decisive difference are you referring to?

Posted by ethan at January 28, 2011 01:36 PM

If the words "right now" are supposed to be a link, it's not working.

Is it, Donald? Is it really? Or are you just so blinded for your love for Egyptian authoritarianism that you can't see that it's working correctly, and always has been?

I'm not insinuating anything, just asking the question.

What kind of decisive difference are you referring to?

It's not crazy to think that Mubarak is in serious trouble, and it's not crazy to think that Americans yelling at the government will make them hesitate in supporting the brutal crackdown that they and Mubarak are surely itching to see.

Posted by Jonathan Schwarz at January 28, 2011 01:56 PM


Really great coverage with plenty of links over on American Leftist.-Tony

http://amleft.blogspot.com/

Posted by tony at January 28, 2011 02:16 PM

Was gonna sign BUT just watched Obama basically sell Mubarak down the river, sooooo, ????? I'm tellin' ya, average president, average. A Gerald Ford.

Posted by Mike Meyer at January 28, 2011 06:43 PM

Dunno what you're referring to, Mike (I just got back from a long bike ride), but the top link in memeorandum this evening is to a Telegraph article entitled, "Egypt protests: America's secret backing for rebel leaders behind uprising"

From the article: "The disclosures, contained in previously secret US diplomatic dispatches released by the WikiLeaks website, show American officials pressed the Egyptian government to release other dissidents who had been detained by the police."

And that's all I've read so far. Anyway, whatever, I went ahead and sent a message.

Posted by godoggo at January 29, 2011 01:12 AM

OK, I just reread your comment. I take it you meant average as opposed to horrible. Just for clarity's sake.

Posted by godoggo at January 29, 2011 01:17 AM

I sent a comment via the link. In my exact words: "Allow the Egyptian people to throw out their dictator."

May my expression of opinion, when combined with those of many others, contribute to the triumph of Truth, Justice, and the Potentially Sentient Way.

Posted by mistah 'MICFiC' charley, ph.d. at January 29, 2011 09:12 AM

JS wrote: "it's not crazy to think that Americans yelling at the government will make them hesitate in supporting the brutal crackdown that they and Mubarak are surely itching to see."

Oh really, well, I guess it may not be socially crazy, because only thinking powerful people can get away with mass murder while everyone averts their eyes is socially crazy, but the one thing a history of the last century has taught to its seven sane students is that what really makes the government 'hesitate' in supporting a brutal crackdown is not "Americans yelling at the government."

Serious, WTF? As you well know (unless the sad day has arrived when you have been replaced by a droid), about ten million people yelled before the last war of aggression against Iraq and nobody OF CONSEQUENCE paid any attention.

Not that yelling at the government isn't enjoyable and important just because there's so much to yell about and so many rotten people who deserve to be yelled at, but come on, get real, the yelling doesn't get any SERIOUS attention unless it serves another purpose, like whipping up support for something else, like maybe some social opinion that can get used in the future to justify some new murderous aggression. (Oh no, now the Islamicists are coming!) I guess we'll see how it plays out.

As for the obscured reality, apparently it's time for Hosni to go, the corrupt old tyrant, just as once upon a time it was time for Anwar to go for quite different reasons. But alas, all those reasons may be hard to find out, especially with Wikileaks the victim of those important Swedish condom laws. But whatever Hosni's problem, unlike Anwar, he seems unlikely to be mourned with a flood of crocodile tears from the Nile, which probably makes him bitter.

Anyway, in the name of the creative forces of the cosmos and the flickering human spirit that darkness always threatens to extinguish, I will put aside my lethal cynicism for a moment and join you and mistah charley in this battle against inevitability, but here we go again:

The King is dead, long live the King!

Posted by N E at January 29, 2011 09:43 AM

You do know that wikileaks is here, right? Sounds like maybe you didn't.

Posted by godoggo at January 29, 2011 10:20 AM

The main Wikileaks page is currently at http://www.wikileaks.ch/ (and in fact even wikileaks.org is redirecting to a usable page now).

Posted by John Caruso at January 29, 2011 11:49 AM

Why do I find that url amusing? Anyway there are a lot of mirrors.

Posted by godoggo at January 29, 2011 12:10 PM

The one that the old site redirects to doesn't seem to be real wikileaks, though.

Posted by godoggo at January 29, 2011 12:19 PM

thanks for the links. I'll have to read some cables instead of relying on what others say about them.

Posted by N E at January 29, 2011 01:38 PM

Another friend of hers is Lanny Davis, so by proxy, she's friends with President Gbagbo. When do we get to hear someone come out and tell us why he's not a dictator?

Posted by LT at January 29, 2011 02:10 PM

I'll bet I see JOBS, JOBS, JOBS at the tear gas plant in Pa.

Posted by Mike Meyer at January 29, 2011 03:11 PM

It's not crazy to think that Mubarak is in serious trouble, and it's not crazy to think that Americans yelling at the government will make them hesitate in supporting the brutal crackdown that they and Mubarak are surely itching to see.

Jon, I agree that Mubarak is in serious trouble but I find it hard to believe the State dept gives a damn what I think. Besides, the US needs to worry now about what will happen to Americans after Mubarak is gone, not "moderating" his behavior. But BHO is too chickenshit to publicly call for Mubarak to resign.

Posted by Jonathan Versen at January 30, 2011 04:11 PM

Jonathan Versen: Eggsfuckinzactly.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, I was singing to the Spirits. As in a dream the TV took me to the heights above Cairo, and no matter which button I push its STILL there. The Spirits say,"See yon columnious smoke signals over the Ancient City?" They say, "It ain't in the paper, its on the wall."

Posted by Mike Meyer at January 30, 2011 07:10 PM

I agree that Mubarak is in serious trouble but I find it hard to believe the State dept gives a damn what I think.

I'm not claiming they care very much, but they do care a tiny amount. And this is one of those rare times when the tiny push we can deliver may make a difference, in this case in the instructions that the US gives to the Egyptian government. Some people in the Obama administration are willing to cut Mubarak loose (not out of the goodness of their hearts, but shifting power relations) and the more we scream at them and about it generally, the more leverage they have against the people who're willing to let Mubarak kill everyone.

Posted by Jonathan Schwarz at January 31, 2011 01:37 PM


Being a huge soccer fan and an anarchist, the link below warms my heart to no end!-Tony

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/dave_zirin/01/31/egypt.soccer/index.html

Posted by tony at January 31, 2011 03:40 PM

Al Jazeera has been showing Biden saying "So no, I would not say he is a dictator" quite frequently. Really, they should just decline to respond or something, rather than let the rest of the world point and laugh at us.

Posted by Anna in PDX at January 31, 2011 03:53 PM

OK Jon,
I wrote to them. I still am very skeptical, and felt a little foolish doing so, but I did.

Posted by Jonathan Versen at January 31, 2011 04:14 PM

Jonathan Schwarz: Promise me YOU will call John Boehner @1-202-225-0600 about Social Security.

Posted by Mike Meyer at January 31, 2011 04:51 PM

Jonathan Versen: HOW can YOU be an activist disenter if YOU don't disent actively, so don't feel foolish. I wrote,"Drop Mubarak. He's done. We'll get better with the next guy."
IF it does any good remanes to be seen.

Posted by Mike Meyer at January 31, 2011 07:52 PM